Build a Practice That Markets Itself (E.334)

Brief Overview of the Episode

Dr. Devin Giron believed that providing excellent dentistry would be enough to build a successful practice.

It was not.

After purchasing his first practice in 2017, Devin found himself losing money, experiencing anxiety, and questioning whether practice ownership was worth the pressure. He knew how to care for patients, but he had not yet built the business systems required to consistently attract them.

That began to change when he stopped waiting for patients to recognize the quality of his work and started intentionally communicating why his practice was different.

Devin is a thirteenth-generation New Mexico resident and the founder of VIDA Dental Studio in Santa Fe. His practice takes a thoughtful, comprehensive approach to care, connecting dentistry with total health and wellness. He intentionally schedules fewer appointments so patients receive his full attention and have time to understand their options.

In Part One, Devin joins Regan Robertson and Sara Hansen to share how that philosophy became the foundation of his marketing.

They discuss his move away from insurance, his decision to invest during uncertain economic conditions, and the community insights that helped VIDA identify new growth opportunities.

Today, Devin leads a growing fee-for-service practice with nine operatories and four doctors. His goal is no longer to simply produce more dentistry. He is building a legacy practice that can grow beyond his individual time in the chair.

What This Episode Reveals

Great clinical care does not automatically create a successful business.

Patients need to understand what makes the practice different before they can choose it.

The most effective marketing begins with a clear practice vision, a defined patient experience, and a team prepared to deliver on the message.

Devin also reveals why marketing should not be treated as a temporary promotion. It is a long-term business function that creates patients, providers, freedom, and future practice value.

What You’ll Learn

• How Devin moved from financial stress to a thriving multi-doctor practice
• Why he continued investing when other practices pulled back
• How VIDA transitioned from insurance dependence to fee-for-service care
• How patient conversations and community frustrations became successful campaigns
• Why marketing growth must support the owner’s larger vision for the practice
• How additional patients and providers can reduce dependence on the doctor’s time

If This Sounds Familiar

You know your clinical work is strong, but the right patients are not finding you.

You tried marketing for a few months and stopped when the results were not immediate.

You are hesitant to invest because a previous campaign failed.

Your schedule is busy, but the business still depends heavily on your personal production.

You want the practice to create more freedom, but growth currently feels like more responsibility.

Next Steps

Start by defining what a successful practice looks like for you.

Identify the patients, services, schedule, and lifestyle that support that vision.

Ask every new patient how they heard about the practice. Pay attention to recurring frustrations, community conversations, and gaps competitors are failing to address.

Then examine whether your team can support the demand your marketing creates.

Can the phone be answered?

Can the patient be scheduled quickly?

Can the team confidently communicate why the practice is worth choosing?

Choose a clear campaign, measure the results, and give it enough time to work before abandoning the strategy.

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TRANSCRIPT

00;00;00;04 – 00;00;02;21
Speaker 1
The Productive Dentist Academy podcast network.

00;00;02;22 – 00;00;12;23
Dr. Devin Girion
Basically do the things that other people are afraid to do, and you will be rewarded with this, quote unquote, a risk. I really don’t think marketing is at risk. I think it’s a long term part of your business.

00;00;12;24 – 00;00;29;26
Regan Robertson
Thanks for tuning in to the Everyday Practice of Dental podcast. I’m Regan Robertson. My co-host Sara Hansen, and I interview real dentists and experts who grow their dental practices using authentic marketing in a way that you can remember, repeat, and use in your own practice to get the patients you deserve. Let’s dive in.

00;00;29;29 – 00;00;38;28
Sara Hansen
Welcome back to the Everyday Practices Podcast. I’m Sarah Hansen and I’m joined by my co-host Reagan Robertson. Reagan, how are you?

00;00;39;01 – 00;00;55;13
Regan Robertson
Oh, I’m doing phenomenal. I’m very excited about our repeat offender coming to join us on the podcast again. But in all seriousness, really excited about the, you know, hearing Devin’s story and providing value to all of our listeners today. Yeah. Super excited.

00;00;55;17 – 00;01;18;18
Sara Hansen
Yeah. So today we’re talking about something that every practice owner really wants more of and that is consistent growth. So our guest today is Doctor Devin Herron. And I could take the next hour and go on about how amazing Devin is and how much I love him. And I work with him and he is he really has done exactly what we’re talking about.

00;01;18;20 – 00;01;40;06
Sara Hansen
Grow the practice. He’s built an incredibly successful fee for service practice. He’s embraced external marketing with strategy in a way that he really understands the market and the patient experience and how they work together. So I’m excited to hear more about your journey. Devin. So, Devin, welcome to the show.

00;01;40;08 – 00;01;44;03
Dr. Devin Girion
Thanks for having me, guys. Glad to be back, Devin.

00;01;44;06 – 00;02;08;16
Sara Hansen
Like Ragan said, you have come on multiple times. You and I have shared the stage together. So for maybe the new listeners that don’t know who you are. I want to start with your story. So when you look back, was there a defining moment when maybe you realized you wanted to build something different than the average dental practice?

00;02;08;19 – 00;02;15;15
Dr. Devin Girion
A tough question. I want to build something different.

00;02;15;17 – 00;02;19;21
Dr. Devin Girion
Like leave my old pride. Like leave kind of what we were doing and. Well, let me.

00;02;19;22 – 00;02;20;12
Sara Hansen
Yeah.

00;02;20;20 – 00;02;21;10
Dr. Devin Girion
Let me start.

00;02;21;11 – 00;02;22;23
Sara Hansen
Start. Yeah. Let’s start with.

00;02;22;23 – 00;02;23;12
Dr. Devin Girion
Your story.

00;02;23;14 – 00;02;24;14
Sara Hansen
Right.

00;02;24;16 – 00;02;48;16
Dr. Devin Girion
Yeah. So basically 2017, I purchased my first practice. I was a public health doctor working for Indian Health Services, and I always thought of myself as a very it sounds horrible, a very good provider. I really thought about what patients trying to do the best entry possible on the patients freedom. Well, and so when I got out, I thought that would just carry over and and patients to realize, hey, they’re going to a good doctor.

00;02;48;16 – 00;03;16;07
Dr. Devin Girion
He’s doing really good work, and therefore we’re going to give them all our money and just he’s going to do great and right off into the sunset and love doing his job. And I couldn’t be further from the truth. So in 2018 I reached out to PDA and it’s been off to the races since then. But initially we started off with not producing any money, not making any money, always in the red.

00;03;16;07 – 00;03;30;26
Dr. Devin Girion
And that led me to have a lot of anxiety regarding dentistry. And so that’s when PDA kind of helped out. And so handsome came in and help with marketing, and we started growing the practice that way.

00;03;30;28 – 00;03;33;04
Sara Hansen
So yeah.

00;03;33;11 – 00;03;45;16
Regan Robertson
You you’re in Santa Fe and and how many how many operators do you have? How many doctors do you have? Be my eyes and ears. Since I’ve always wanted to actually physically go into your practice and haven’t yet made it there.

00;03;45;18 – 00;04;07;19
Dr. Devin Girion
Yeah. You got it. I think we have nine operators. All right. We have four providers now working there, three full time. By full time, I mean three days each. I currently work two days and three days. Doctor Dietrich currently work two days and three days. Doctor Saudi works three full days. And Doctor Dietrich’s wife Davina works 1 to 2 days.

00;04;07;22 – 00;04;15;09
Dr. Devin Girion
So nine laboratories have four doctors kind of going in and out of there. It’s pretty neat. And we’re looking to expand, so.

00;04;15;12 – 00;04;20;01
Regan Robertson
Oh, excellent. That’s on the horizon in the next year or two years.

00;04;20;03 – 00;04;36;05
Dr. Devin Girion
It took us about three years to get permits. So we finally got through that stage. And so now it’s just trying to decide exactly what we want and how we want to build it out. So probably in the next year or two, we’ll be able to grow it out and get more doctors in there and take more days off.

00;04;36;06 – 00;04;37;22
Regan Robertson
Congratulations.

00;04;37;23 – 00;04;40;08
Dr. Devin Girion
Thank you. Yeah, it’s been been a journey for sure.

00;04;40;09 – 00;04;45;15
Regan Robertson
Are you truly so are you truly full fee for service as a practice right now?

00;04;45;17 – 00;05;14;12
Dr. Devin Girion
Yeah. We don’t. I mean, we used to take Delta Dental and that was a really we were about 44% Delta Dental when we decided to drop them. And so that was a fun thing to do. I think when doctors are considering signing up for more insurances, it’s usually about a year process of trying to not to educate the patients in terms of we’re not in network with your provider.

00;05;14;12 – 00;05;31;06
Dr. Devin Girion
And that’s a very thing because it’s easy. It’s guess it’s harder now to take insurance policies. They take a little bit longer to sign up for. But once you’re in bed with them, it’s it’s hard. They have their claws like really embedded in you. And a lot of those contracts are takes a long time to cancel them. Really.

00;05;31;08 – 00;05;43;21
Dr. Devin Girion
Yeah. So it’s not it’s not as simple as you think. So you’re like all of a sudden it for another insurance policy. But when you try to drop that insurance policy there are contracts and fine rent that need to be aware of. It’s tough.

00;05;43;25 – 00;05;45;03
Sara Hansen
Yep.

00;05;45;05 – 00;05;47;10
Dr. Devin Girion
So does that make sense?

00;05;47;15 – 00;06;06;20
Regan Robertson
Yeah, absolutely. It does make sense. And I, I thank you for sharing so openly because I know there’s a lot of practices right now out there that yeah, that are that are in that seat of I don’t even know where to begin like those first steps. So I think for you, I’ve seen the success of you go from, like you said, being at that moment of this isn’t working.

00;06;06;20 – 00;06;26;13
Regan Robertson
I’m stressing out financially. I’ve got to take that first step. And what I love about you, Devin, is you are you have the distinction of saying, I understand and I’m self-reflective, that I’m overthinking this and I need to just take action. And so many of us need to just take that step in the right direction. And then once you once you take the first step, the second is a little bit easier.

00;06;26;13 – 00;06;44;03
Regan Robertson
And it feels cliche, but to see your journey and to where you’re at now is is so inspiring to it. And I think, Sarah, you know, to your testament, you’re wanting to tell that story of of the first steps taken to where he’s at today, which is, you know, marketing strategic faster. Really?

00;06;44;07 – 00;07;16;16
Sara Hansen
Yeah, yeah. And what I love about Devin is, you know, him and I truly, I believe, have a partnership within marketing. You know, I can only tell the story that’s coming from Devin. And what I love about him is his team, the other doctors in his practice, the way that they show up for patients, it makes my job really easy to tell the marketing story and be able to kind of formulate good strategies to help make them successful.

00;07;16;17 – 00;07;36;21
Sara Hansen
So, Devin, talking about your marketing, what I mean, how do you identify successful marketing and can you speak to, you know, how you define that to be? Because I can say it, but what does that actually mean for you to be successful in marketing?

00;07;36;24 – 00;08;00;14
Dr. Devin Girion
I think with with marketing, it’s almost like an evolution of it in terms of initially, as you’re starting off your practice, you just want to get butts in the chair and you’re trying to trying to get money in your bank account. And so it almost seems like you’re trying to serve the masses, right. As you grow and your bank account grows and your practice grows, there’s only you only have two hands.

00;08;00;14 – 00;08;26;05
Dr. Devin Girion
And so you have to think, how do I attract the patients that I want, right. Yeah. And attracting the patients that you want could be a really busy insurance practice driven practice, which some, some dentists really like being really busy and they don’t feel like they’re doing a good job unless they’re really busy. Yeah. And so downtime they freak out and then so therefore they take every insurance policy.

00;08;26;08 – 00;08;52;12
Dr. Devin Girion
That wasn’t my vision. My vision was, hey, how can we do the least amount of work, get the most amount of profit, have a balance between my home life and work, have my staff like me at the end of the day. So that’s kind of where you start thinking, what type of patients do I want to attract? And that’s where you come in, Sara and your team and asking and discovering your code.

00;08;52;12 – 00;09;08;11
Dr. Devin Girion
Discovering, you know, what is it, what, what what’s a successful day look like for you? Because if you can’t define that, then you’re just kind of not really giving the marketing company guidance. Successful marketing is also measuring.

00;09;08;13 – 00;09;28;08
Dr. Devin Girion
If you’re putting a certain dollar amount in, what are you getting out? Yeah. And so this team does an excellent job of showing the ROI with quarterly reports so that you can manage the marketing money as well and really put the money in the proper funnels.

00;09;28;10 – 00;09;57;12
Sara Hansen
Yeah. So yeah. Yeah. Devin, I love how you speak so much to kind of the process and the flow and where you started and where you are now, because we’ve been working together for a very long time, and your marketing has evolved and shifted and changed as your practice has. You know, one of the things I want to speak to that I love about you is, you know, doctors sometimes are really afraid to invest in marketing.

00;09;57;15 – 00;10;22;24
Sara Hansen
Oftentimes they’ve been burned themselves, you know, by maybe different things or campaign didn’t work as well. And what I love about you is you’re so strategic when it comes to, you know, guidance of that and pulling in, hey, how do we make this successful? So during Covid, when, you know, we were all shut down, a lot of doctors actually shut off their marketing.

00;10;22;24 – 00;10;39;10
Sara Hansen
They, you know, stopped paying for their websites. They put them on pause for a little while. And what I love about you is you’re one of the few doctors that didn’t do that. You called me up and you said, Sarah, what do I do? New Mexico is one of the last states to open. And so what we did is we pivoted everything to emergency, right?

00;10;39;12 – 00;11;11;28
Sara Hansen
We rewrote the mailers. We did different campaigns because at that time patients were still needing dental care. But unfortunately, a lot of dentists were unable to work. And so we worked around the guidelines that we could. And what that did is that paid off well for you. So I want you to speak to that a little bit for other doctors that are maybe nervous about really investing strategically in their their practices for growth when, you know, at a time when you it was scary, but you kind of took that that leap of faith and it paid off big, right.

00;11;11;29 – 00;11;25;06
Sara Hansen
Because now you have patients have been coming to you since that time, and they’ve been loyal patients because you were the only one who was open and around and you were that voice in the market. Can you speak to that a little bit?

00;11;25;09 – 00;11;40;02
Dr. Devin Girion
I think it’s just human nature. I mean, the fear of the unknown is greater than the fear of the known. And so most dentists, most human beings, live their life that way. And.

00;11;40;05 – 00;12;06;21
Dr. Devin Girion
It’s sad because you have to take risk, your business owner. That’s why you kind of got into it. You believe the name air can dream, you believe that you could make it. And so many of our colleagues are suffering in silence, and they’re more afraid of losing money, and they can’t realize that they’re losing so much more by not marketing and not working within their business.

00;12;06;24 – 00;12;43;17
Dr. Devin Girion
And I’m in a business group where we have plumbers and every single facet business owner. There’s about 15 of us and we all have the same programing. It almost seems like. And it’s a fear of consulting. It’s it’s a fear of spending too much money on marketing. And when you look at human nature, that’s to your benefit. Because I know eight out of ten dentists are going to be afraid of doing something, and I use that to my advantage.

00;12;43;19 – 00;13;03;01
Dr. Devin Girion
And that’s the I think that’s scary for other Dennis. I know there’s always patients to go around, but if I was a dentist in my town, I’d be like, goodness gracious. Like I’ve got to compete against not like this, this asshole. Like, that’s what I’d be thinking. Like, this is going to be very difficult because he’s going to push the limits.

00;13;03;04 – 00;13;08;15
Dr. Devin Girion
We have patients say, like, when are you going to put your face on the side of a bus? And I love it.

00;13;08;18 – 00;13;12;07
Regan Robertson
When are you going to put your face on the side of a bus? Don’t tempt me.

00;13;12;12 – 00;13;15;01
Speaker 5
I love you.

00;13;15;03 – 00;13;52;01
Dr. Devin Girion
But and I think a lot. I was talking to orthodontist. I was like, hey, why don’t you market, man? You’re a great, great clinician. And, you know, it’d be great for patients to know about you and was concerned about what other people thought of him. And I was more like, who cares? And I know that’s really hard for human beings to accept because we all care to a certain degree, what other people think of as, but I mean, would you I remember someone who said that, would you rather be right or would you rather be right or rich?

00;13;52;03 – 00;14;12;16
Dr. Devin Girion
Would you rather be right or rich? Right. And for me, I’d rather have the money and be happy and not have to think about it. This something’s right or wrong or whatever. So I’m not sure where I was going with this, but basically do the things that other people are afraid to do and you will be rewarded.

00;14;12;17 – 00;14;24;27
Dr. Devin Girion
Was this, quote unquote a risk? I really don’t think marketing is at risk. I think it’s a long term part of your business. We find Dennis that do it for a couple of months and say, oh, see, it didn’t work. I told you what, your work.

00;14;24;28 – 00;14;25;10
Speaker 5
Yeah.

00;14;25;12 – 00;14;40;23
Dr. Devin Girion
And you go in there saying it’s not going to work. Of course it’s not going to work. Anything you roll out with your office, if you think it’s not going to work, it’s if you don’t embrace it wholeheartedly, it’s not going to work. So this is a long term strategy for long term growth and for people who are visionaries in their business.

00;14;40;26 – 00;15;02;10
Dr. Devin Girion
If you want a short term dopamine hit, it’s not for you. If you want to run a business and you don’t have a marketing arm, maybe running a business is not for you. I hate to say it. Just because you’re a good dentist doesn’t mean you’re going to attract the proper patients. It’s okay to be hated by colleagues because you market everywhere.

00;15;02;10 – 00;15;16;12
Dr. Devin Girion
That’s okay. We have people in my area. They hate me. My patients come back to me because they want to get second opinions and they say, you know what? You talk a lot of crap about you and I’m okay with them. I’m all right with that. Because when your number one, you’re going to have a target on your back.

00;15;16;13 – 00;15;17;14
Speaker 5
I’m sorry.

00;15;17;17 – 00;15;29;20
Dr. Devin Girion
So you use a marketing as something that you can leverage because other people aren’t willing to do it. Other people aren’t willing to put their face on the side of a bus, which I haven’t done yet. But other people.

00;15;29;21 – 00;15;30;26
Speaker 5
Are great. Yeah.

00;15;30;28 – 00;15;50;04
Dr. Devin Girion
Just wait. Right. So no, it’s a good thing. It’s a good thing for people to know you. It’s a good thing we have patients prefer patients that who have never been to our practice. Yeah. You refer them. Who is this person? They’re like, oh, yeah. She always talks good about you. So, Yeah, I mean, it’s just another tool in your toolbox.

00;15;50;06 – 00;15;50;27
Speaker 5
Yeah.

00;15;51;01 – 00;16;15;00
Sara Hansen
Devin, what I love about you, and you’re speaking to it, but I really want to dive deeper into this is I get phone calls from you. I mean, I as much as you know, I’d love to be in Santa Fe with you every day hanging out. We would have a really fun day. But I’m not right. And so what I love about you and our partnership with marketing is really, you’ll call me and say, hey, Sarah, I’ve heard about this dentist.

00;16;15;00 – 00;16;32;18
Sara Hansen
They can’t get patients in for two months, even emergencies. And we take that information that we’re hearing in the community and we create a campaign around it. So you and I start creating campaigns that are targeting those areas, you know, that are saying, hey, are you waiting weeks to get in to see a dentist? We can see you today.

00;16;32;18 – 00;16;58;16
Sara Hansen
Give us a call. Right. So what I love about, again, how your strategy aligns is you’re my eyes and ears into what’s happening. And then we formulate something really fun to kind of hit those areas that you see in the community or that you’re hearing. And now we’re serving more patients who are looking for really great dentists. And that’s what I love is that once the patients find you, they never go anywhere.

00;16;58;18 – 00;17;23;05
Sara Hansen
Right. But it’s how do they find you? And so it’s that that marketing messaging that’s going out with that strategy of what’s actually going to work. Where are those gaps that we’re missing within the community? Where are we finding opportunities? And you nail that every time with letting me know where that is. And then I take it and then we can, you know, execute out the campaign and what that looks like.

00;17;23;06 – 00;17;55;28
Sara Hansen
Now, your team’s prepared for it right internally. Now you’re creating systems to get those patients in the same day because that’s what we’re marketing. So it’s really this well-functioning kind of business strategy that one one piece can’t really function without the other. And so I love that you spoke to that a little bit, because I think doctors are afraid sometimes to take those strategic risks of, hey, I hear about a doctor that’s retiring, you know, how do we capitalize on just letting other patients know that we’re here?

00;17;56;00 – 00;18;28;13
Dr. Devin Girion
Right? You mentioned early this second ago, it’s more than just marketing. If you if you guys effectively market in, our receptionist can’t answer the phone if the new patient that’s a problem. If you we get you in and it’s seven months out that’s a problem. If we if it goes from the receptionist to one of our team members of the dentist and they can’t communicate really well, that’s a problem.

00;18;28;13 – 00;18;50;03
Dr. Devin Girion
So all of those things have to be ironed out. It’s you have marketing and you have your practice. And I’m not sure of the weight of both. But if you can’t convert a patient, if you if your receptionist can’t covert a patient, you can do all the marketing the world and just waste it. So if you can’t get a patient in a timely manner, that’s a big problem.

00;18;50;08 – 00;19;11;01
Regan Robertson
Then the the campaign is wildly creative. I that made my mouth drop open to to think about hearing and listening to the community and then saying, you know, there’s an opportunity here for us. So that extends out of what I would think of as traditional marketing. I would consider it active listening. So you’re actively listening to the community.

00;19;11;01 – 00;19;34;28
Regan Robertson
And that is something that really no external marketing agency is something that that they can typically help for or even really proactively would think of. I’m wondering how like when you look at your week and your and you’re hopping around, I know you’re active just in general in the dentistry community. So you’re a great mentor and and you’re offering you’re listening, you’re offering advice and forums.

00;19;34;28 – 00;19;51;06
Regan Robertson
How does that how does that fit into your into your week since you are practicing in your, you know, a busy family person to how do you lay out what’s your formula for that? For keeping your eyes and ears open in the community and listening for opportunities like that, that pop up?

00;19;51;08 – 00;20;12;04
Dr. Devin Girion
Yeah. So every reaction with the patient is, is the opportunity to ask, how did you hear about us? And it’s nice to send a thank you letter to the person that referred them. It’s nice to hear. Oh, I heard about you on Next Door or your Google reviews were fantastic. These are just touch points that I find I love it.

00;20;12;04 – 00;20;30;27
Dr. Devin Girion
I love knowing how people found us. And so the dentist actually asking that kind of knows where you need to search, right? So number one, I’m a nickel about looking at our top competitors in the area and their Google reviews. We all know we all get crazy Google reviews, including myself. So you take it with a grain of salt.

00;20;30;27 – 00;20;44;13
Dr. Devin Girion
But there are some themes that show up in those Google reviews and it’s like, okay, we can tackle that problem. Next door is the wild West of boomers just talking crap.

00;20;44;15 – 00;20;47;28
Speaker 5
Really. I’m not on next door. I’ve heard next door.

00;20;48;00 – 00;20;52;28
Regan Robertson
I’ve been encouraged not to get on next door because they said, you’re just going to go down a rabbit.

00;20;52;28 – 00;20;53;21
Speaker 5
Hole, you’re.

00;20;53;21 – 00;21;22;16
Dr. Devin Girion
Going to go down a rabbit hole. Luckily for us, it’s hey, they’re they’re exceptional. Providers are the best of the best, but they’re wildly expensive. Which which I think is great because it already takes away a lot of the patients that would, you know, in nature phone with phone calls. Right. You’re getting quality patients. So of course you have Facebook.

00;21;22;18 – 00;21;54;17
Dr. Devin Girion
There’s some wild stuff on there too. But we have a pretty stellar reputation of having quality but being expensive. So I’m on those every single day. And I don’t, I don’t know, I mean, I’m really heavy on hey, let’s get Google reviews. It’s look at them taken seriously. Let’s, let’s see what the people are saying. And there’s a big difference between someone saying like, great staff and then someone writing a paragraph or two paragraphs about how how good your practice is and how it’s different.

00;21;54;18 – 00;22;05;00
Dr. Devin Girion
So I don’t think it’s necessarily the sheer number of them. We have 1200, but it’s the quality of those reviews. Right?

00;22;05;01 – 00;22;26;22
Regan Robertson
I’m I’m very interested. Sarah, I have a question for both of you. Well, you know, so there’s different approaches to marketing strategies. There’s you can do an annual plan that gives you the overarching theme for the year. You can do a quarterly marketing strategy session and get the next 90 days mapped out. You can go down and do a month and activate a campaign within a month.

00;22;26;22 – 00;22;43;11
Regan Robertson
What is your process together as partners? And this is it. When you mentioned Sarah like that, Devin is texting you. Is it is it when you set up a campaign, is it like what’s the runway look like for that? And then how does that fit into the overall plan?

00;22;43;13 – 00;23;09;15
Sara Hansen
Yeah. So what I love about Devin, when again, his marketing has evolved over time. So right now Devin is what we call really in a sweet spot of he’s investing heavily into marketing. However his returns on investment are unbelievable. I mean 29 to 1, you know things like that. So he’s in this sweet spot of we’ve really fine tuned enough that he’s getting the goals that he wants.

00;23;09;15 – 00;23;39;05
Sara Hansen
But what’s fun about Devin is oftentimes, you know, we’ll meet. And he’s like, hey, what about if we invest, you know, a little bit more into this because again he will see an opportunity in the community. And so strategically we’ll create maybe a six month campaign to target this specific area or you know, something like that. And so it gets really fun because as the core of his marketing is shifting and still producing what he wants.

00;23;39;06 – 00;23;57;08
Sara Hansen
We’re also able to kind of play around with new ideas or new campaigns. And then the other thing that Devin’s really good about is if he finds a campaign and I’m like, Devin, you are killing it with this. So, for example, Hulu commercials were something that, you know, we tried Wet Devin three years ago, maybe two and a half years ago.

00;23;57;08 – 00;24;22;00
Sara Hansen
We started with a few Hulu commercials, and what we found is that the patients coming in, we’re talking about it all the time, and we were seeing the traffic engage. We were seeing in the reviews. People were talking about it. So what that then Devin’s like, let’s do some more, right? So what I love about it is now he has three different Hulu commercials that were running.

00;24;22;00 – 00;24;46;18
Sara Hansen
They all focus on different things. He’s got next door neighbor ads. He has actually two different mailers that are going out because again, one is very focused. We have his family. We’ve got, you know, a lot of the core services kind of Devin’s story. But then the other mailer is all about emergency care, because again, going back to what Devin saw in the community is patients are waiting months to be seen.

00;24;46;18 – 00;25;08;04
Sara Hansen
And yet they’ve created a schedule internally that allows them to see patients same day or the next day. And so again, we’re capitalizing on that right of patients that are getting frustrated. He’s reading in the next door neighbor forums that these patients are frustrated, they can’t get in their teeth hurt. And so he’s now coming to the community with with a solution.

00;25;08;04 – 00;25;18;29
Sara Hansen
And then it’s my job to kind of get that messaging out to those different platforms. So that’s really how we kind of strategically work together. Devin, anything else to add from your end?

00;25;19;01 – 00;25;40;15
Dr. Devin Girion
Yeah, so mainly with the marketing team that Sarah has, it’s kind of set it and forget it. I get an idea I shoot it over. He works with it and shoots a plan back. Very minimal. There’s not a lot I have to do other than just pull little. He has to pull little dials that, hey, we’re gonna take money from this and put it over here or.

00;25;40;15 – 00;25;51;09
Dr. Devin Girion
No, we’re going to take more money and put it over here. I’m still at the point where I’m like, I don’t think we’ve maximized the campaigns. If their conversation last this week, I’m like, let’s find the max.

00;25;51;11 – 00;25;51;23
Speaker 5
Yeah.

00;25;51;24 – 00;26;10;10
Dr. Devin Girion
It was. The sooner I can find the max, you know, I can figure out, let’s put money towards this. Because our hours, our growth, the more we grow, the quicker I can add providers, quicker I can have providers, the more I can keep it back, the more I have time with my family, the more if I’m not going to do this.

00;26;10;10 – 00;26;31;03
Dr. Devin Girion
But if you’re like every other dentist in the world now, they’re like, I want to sell my business for $48 billion. And at one point I was like, I want to do that. And then I was like, no, I want a legacy practice. I want something that out lives me. I want something that I don’t have to work at, and it’ll still make money.

00;26;31;06 – 00;26;50;12
Dr. Devin Girion
That’s where I was like, that’s what I want to do. And that’s where Doctor Dietrich and myself or kind of saying like, that’s what we want. And so but if you’re thinking about selling to private equity, I remember when we didn’t did a evaluation.

00;26;50;15 – 00;26;51;04
Speaker 5
Yeah.

00;26;51;05 – 00;27;18;12
Dr. Devin Girion
You had in our practice, 90% of the production was done by two providers. That severely decreases the evaluation money because you’re the biggest linchpin in your practice. If you go down, if you quit, it’s over. Party’s over. Private equity is not going to invest in you. So the sooner you can get unchained from the chair market appropriately, have the business that doesn’t need you to run.

00;27;18;12 – 00;27;38;12
Dr. Devin Girion
That’s a true business, right? Be independent of you. The sooner you can go with private equity and you don’t care if it’s 5 to 7 years because you’re not even working right, it’ll still manage, but you’re not working. So marketing works. I mean, it just depends on what you want, what your vision is. You need it. It’s something that you have to have.

00;27;38;13 – 00;27;46;14
Dr. Devin Girion
If you don’t have it like like, why stop there? Just get rid of the internet. Get rid of your phone, get rid of you need it.

00;27;46;16 – 00;28;00;12
Speaker 6
Thanks for listening to today’s episode with Devin. We only scratched the surface. Join Regan and me next week for part two as we continue the conversation on growth, risk and the mindset behind building a thriving practice.