Episode 131 – The Easy Way to Integrate Dental Sleep Medicine with John Nadeau

“You’re not going to make millions in sleep dentistry if you’re taking the burden on yourself. You have to delegate…then you’ll be producing even when you go on vacation for a week.”
-John Nadeau

If you’re like most independent dentists, you want to offer the best care to your patients. In the search for comprehensive health solution for their patients, many dentists are turning to dental sleep medicine. Unfortunately, the process of integrating dental sleep solutions into a practice isn’t always successful. 

Sadly, many dentists think integrating dental sleep medicine is hard. The truth is, it’s actually easy (and profitable)…with the right training and the right system.

John Nadeau from Sleep Group Solutions joins us today for a mind-blowing conversation about the easy way to integrate sleep solutions into your practice:

• How to apply what you’ve learned in education to your care procedures
• Best business practices to make sleep medicine profitable
• Getting your team on board as sleep medicine champions

INTEGRATE DENTAL SLEEP MEDICINE
Many dentists right now are curious about integrating dental sleep medicine in an effort to help their patients live happier, healthier lives. Don’t let the fear of the unknown stop you! The reality is, integrating dental sleep medicine is easy and profitable – with the right training and the right systems in place.

This is why PDA has invited Sleep Group Solutions to the upcoming PDA Workshop this September 16-18, 2021 in Texas to help dentists AND team integrate dental sleep medicine with the support of PDA’s proven systems.

Register at productivedentist.com/workshop.

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

REGAN: Welcome to another episode of Everyday Practices Podcast. I am your co-host, Regan  Roberson, here with Dr. CHAD:, how are you doing CHAD:?

CHAD:: I’m doing all right. How’s it going?

REGAN: Chad doesn’t know that we’re actually going to put this video up. So I love that you just framed it. Everybody can see what I get to see at least once a week.

CHAD: To the listeners. If you are a sequential listener. I do apologize for taking my family on vacation the last couple of recordings. So I want you to know that I’m in good standing with Reagan and she still loves me and hasn’t kicked me off of the podcast. And here I am to record with you also. John, good to see you. Thanks for joining us. Regan, would you introduce our guest.

REGAN:  Absolutely. So Everyday Practices listeners, we have a really special guests today. PDA. As you know, Productive Dentist Academy is excited to partner with Sleep Group Solutions to host a two day sleep certification course this is running congruently with the PDA Workshop, September 16 to 18th in Irving, Texas. This course is the premier course in the nation to get your team up and running quickly, including dental sleep, medicine, and I had a bit of an educational hump on that I didn’t realize how the team is involved in dental Sleep Medicine together. So we are excited to have slick group solutions.

Joining us is John Nadeau is joining us today. John has been helping dental practices succeed clinically and financially with sleep medicine for over 20 years. John, you’re instrumental in developing Sleep Group Solutions program for sleep. I’m learning I can’t wait to talk to you, which focuses on ensuring predictable clinical outcomes. exceptional case acceptance, ringing and maximum reimbursement for dental sleep apnea treatment. Welcome to the show, John.

JOHN: Thank you guys. I’m happy to be here. This is great. I’m really looking forward to the PDA Workshop. It’s, it’s, it’s been a long time. And we’re we’re excited just to get back to any sort of live big meetings and oh, yeah, just telling me the attendance is looking great. So I’m excited. It’s gonna be a great program.

REGAN: We are we are almost we are 80% sold out. I just got the notification that we’re nearing 90% sold out. So I know it’s going to be a full packed house. The big question I have for you, john in this though, is why is dental Sleep Medicine easier to integrate in the practice than most people think?

JOHN:  It’s, well, easy to integrate is that is a tricky thing. I think that the nice thing with you know, because we’re just talking about some of the pitfalls, right, we’re just talking before the recording about some of the things that come up where, you know, we don’t want to be just ordering a random snore guard, sleep appliance kind of arbitrarily and throwing it in because, you know, there’s some risk there too. We can get into that. But now the nice thing with sleep is that it’s it is very systematic, and it’s very reproducible. You know, I spent a lot of time in the craniofacial pain world and the TMD, and all that stuff.

And Gosh, every case is like a million what ifs, right there could have been so many things wrong, there’s so many different directions you can go and different schools of thought on treatments and, and diagnostics and measurements and all this stuff. And sleep is very predictable. It’s very reproducible. And what you did with this patient today is probably the same thing you’re gonna do with the one tomorrow and the next day and the next day and the next day. You know, with some variances and appliances, but for the most part, it’s you know, the there’s a pretty good system to follow. So, you know, there is a learning curve. And I think getting your team educated is huge like you talked about, but with a well trained team in asleep can be something you can plug into a practice you can plug into a general dental practice relatively easily. And can produce?

CHAD: Well, that would be the case with anything. If someone said, well, with a poor system, it’s really hard. And someone could say, well, you know, but with the right system, it’s easy. And both are correct. But it’s a mindset issue. That if someone said, Well, yeah, but I, whenever I, you know, throw ingredients together, and it doesn’t even produce a cake. And someone says, Well, yeah, cuz you’re not doing it the right way. And of course, that would be frustrating and hard.

And that’s the next person that saying that it’s easy, isn’t exactly correct. If they’re saying, well, it’s just easy for anyone just to do it’s like, no, it’s easy to do. If you follow the steps in the system correctly. I’m going to follow on that, right. Because I think my point would have been, you know, like Sleep Medicine is harder to introduce than you would think your premise is sleep medicine is easier to implement than you would think. And I think the parentheses would be with the right team training and the right system.

JOHN: 100% It definitely boils back to that. I think if you, you know, there’s a couple things about sleep that I love, that that make it easy one, there’s a lot of low hanging fruit here. You know, we’re not talking about a needle in a haystack kind of situation where you’ve got to search high and low and sideways everyday for patients that you might or might not find. You know, the reality is that today, everybody that’s listening to this, one out of three of your adult patients that walked in your door today for anything has diagnoseable amount of obstructive sleep apnea. That’s the ratio, that’s the reality.

And so, if we create a system where we’re engaging them, and we’re saying the right things, and we’re putting those people on the correct path, and that’s, you know, when I come down to the workshop, that’s what I’m gonna spend the better part of a couple days talking about is, how do we engage them through education and engage them to the next step, it’s not about acrylic, right? It’s not about selling that super expensive, because if there’s no value around it, that that piece of acrylic, for 1000s of dollars, oh my gosh, there’s so much I could go buy that a Walgreens for 30 bucks, right. So it’s not about selling appliances, it’s about selling to the next step and raising the patient’s level of awareness about their disease.

And if they understand their problem, there comes motivation to address it. But you got to you got to take them through a few steps First, and people are so quick to talk about therapy. And, you know, they don’t take time to pause, put themselves in a patient’s shoes, and really try to understand and get them to own that problem. Because once you’re there, once they own it, you’re golden. I mean, you’re it’s a slam dunk.

But it takes a couple steps to get there. And, you know, that’s that’s the key. And it’s it’s super important, having your team the entire team on board with that. So your hygenist is now screening and identifying and in looking at dental risk factors, you know, yeah, there’s, there’s 100 things that are that could be wrong with you medically, that are related to yours undiagnosed, untreated, sleep disordered breathing problem. But if I can find two or three dental red flags, that kind of validates why as a dentist, we’re even talking about it right? Why are we bringing up sleep doesn’t make sense?

Well, okay, I’m seeing that you’re, you know, you’re clenching and bruxing and nadigar, thrusting your tongue and I can see that and so, you know, that indicates there could be an airway problem here, let’s, you know, let’s take it a step further. Let’s investigate that because I’m concerned about this. And then then we slowly bring in other pieces. But if we do it the right way, with that right system, you know, we gert a lot of people on board a lot of people to own their problem. That’s all.

CHAD: So what I hear too is for the dentist that is in the Productive Dentist Academy mindset, which would also carry over to other mindsets, for example, but you know, a trained dentist, someone that’s looking at saying, How can I offer the best to my patients? And how do I offer them a comprehensive answer to their health, not just their problems, but you know, looking at their health overall, it’s not just about hey, you have happy clean teeth. You have, you know, you have some mobile teeth and the old school answer was, must be periodontal disease, or it must be occlusion. But what we used to just stop the answer right there and it must be occlusion is that occlusion? Must be related to a bigger picture as well. There are some people that are just grinders.

Fine, fair enough. But when we start incorporating airway into it, the aha moment that really, for me started opening up about 10 years ago, you know, to be like, Oh wow, like the, we never were taught this in dental school that someone’s airway, and they’re, you know, it could be the problem of their cardiovascular health. And then also that could be coalescing with their periodontal disease slash occlusion slash loose teeth issues and it’s bigger than just fixing happy teeth and you know, cleaning teeth and doing occlusal composites for cavities

JOHN:100% you have to have that that whole big picture and I agree there’s that there’s that functional connection all the way around airway plays a pivotal role, you know, from early childhood on up right and some of the some of the problems some of the you know, developmental you know, orthodontic deficiencies and problems that develop are rooted in airway many of them are and then certainly as an adult, with with how, with that preexisting problem, if you have your dental blinders on and we’re only thinking about you know, only thinking about teeth, then you’re going to see complications that come right, we’re gonna see relapse, and damaged or, you know, stored at work and everything related to that patient still having a nighttime airway issue.

REGAN: John, this is what makes me so passionate hearing you and even talking in the pre interview portion is my sister was diagnosed with sleep apnea in her I think, late 30s, mid to late 30s. And growing up, she always we made fun of her snore, she was the loudest snore in the house, like hands down. And, you know, we didn’t think much of it and it hurts me because, you know, she went to the dentist, she still goes to the dentist regularly. You know, she had multiple opportunities with medical professionals to be educated. And it was it wasn’t brought up for so long.

And I know I’m good friends with Dr. Magna Dasani. I believe she’s gone through sleep group solutions. When I learned about Dr. Ken Smith, about a decade ago, my mind was absolutely blown apart. And I thought more people need to know about this. And why wouldn’t dentistry play a role in this? If you see it? You can’t unsee it? I know Chad as I’ve been through so many PDA workshops. I feel like dentists get to this point. And once you see it, you can’t unsee it you it’s  now part of your problem to solve. And can you tell us john like Dr. Ken Smith, Dr. Meghna Dasani, what kind of roles did they play in sleep? Kois group solutions? How has that helped them in their journey?

JOHN: Well, we have a huge roster of, you know, of K wells, and just really successful dentists out there that have that have taken sleep to, you know, in some cases, an exclusive level, right? Not Not everybody starts that way. Rarely do people start that way. But you know, as it starts out as an adjunct to your your dental practice, I’ve seen it many, many, many times where it just overtakes it, and it becomes the dominant thing, if not the only thing, like with Dr. Smith, you know, it’s just kind of the top of the pyramid example there, I think, certainly in Texas, in terms of sleep production, but, you know, the bottom line is that, that opportunity is there for a lot of people.

And it’s, there’s no, there’s no secret sauce. There’s no magic trick there. And I think that’s why I love these two day programs. And what we can do with the workshop, you know, we’ll talk about that is, you know, what’s your plan going home? Because what you made an awesome point about you, once you see it, you can’t unsee it, and I make a joke about it in my lectures, I say Good, good luck, go home and try not to see everybody with sleep apnea, get on the plane on your flight home, and you’re gonna see people carrying on see paps, and you’re like, Wait a second, why is that everyone’s got one now.

And all of a sudden, you look and it’s just in your face everywhere. And your first you know, three hygiene checks you do on Monday morning, all of them are gonna have airway problems. And you’re like, Oh my god, like, everywhere. And that’s the best. I love that I love when people call me and they’re like, so I got 25 people lined up now what do I go, that’s the best to play. Okay, now, now it’s time but you know, this, it starts with those people. It starts with people like your sister.

You know, and I talked about that, you know, often is, you know, we get a new practice on board. And, you know, a lot of people and I realize we’re talking to somebody that’s a marketer, right? So you’re all about the marketing, but you know, it starts out you come back to your practice on Monday and you’ve got a team of six or eight people and they’ve got six or eight spouses and they’ve got parents and siblings and everybody, just through that group. They’re the people that are immediately close to you and your team.

There’s a dozen cases to be had. Almost every time, you know, and that’s those, those are the people we want to take care of you owe it to them to take care of them anyway. And what better way to create advocates right to create outspoken sleep champions in your practice than to take care of them or better yet take care of their spouse, right? Let’s take care of that. So that, you know, your hygienist can now sleep in the same bedroom as her as her spouse again, and, you know, that’s the thing 24% of married couples over 40 sleep in separate bedrooms, some or all of the time because of one of the partner’s snoring.

So a lot of people, so take care of that. And I know we’re not talking about snoring snoring is a is a side effect, snoring is kind of a side issue. But if we can remedy the apnea, the snoring will get better also, you know, and that’s how we create some some raving fans in the practice. And they’re going to be happy to talk to a patient about it with the real deep level of personal belief that that gets the conversation started. You know, so many people think they needed to know one of the mistakes I see is a lot of practices think, gosh, I need to go out and, and network with physicians, I need to go find me, you know, a sleep doctor.

That’s step one, and I got news for you that sleep doctor has been approached by a lot of other dentists before you, you’re not special, you know, there’s not, you’re not going to just work your way in there. The way to do it is to take care of the people close to you and the people close to you have physicians, your patients that physicians primary care, Doc’s EMTs cardiologists, all of whom are involved in that patient’s care. And by communicating with those people, we start to build a base of knowledge about what you’re doing the fact you’re doing it on it on a clinically elite level, which goes to you know, something you said, CHAD:, right away, which is you’re doing right, you know, and if you can communicate the right way, and do this the correct way, with the proper measuring, testing follow up, you know, it’s going to separate you from the guy down the street that’s just taken up or lower impression mailing it off to a lab and hoping that it does something good.

CHAD: So what kind of Yeah, but do you get from people that are? Or do you even get that by the time that they’re there training and learning. But let’s say that you’re at a dinner conversation with some dentists or, you know, something like that, and you’re talking with them, and they go, I’ve tried that before, you know, or there’s, there’s a really good reason why I don’t you know, care about looking more into sleep apnea, it just doesn’t work. I mean, to hear stuff like that, or I mean, do you hear people with with strong opinions that are like, Man, I wish I could say something bold to this guy right now. Like, what what are some of the things that you hear?

JOHN:  I hear things that, you know, the probably the two biggest? I don’t say rebuttal. It’s not the right word. But objection, objection. Yeah. The first one is medical insurance. You know, either they’ve tried it, right, I made an appliance. And I, you know, I delivered a device totally blind without any sort of, you know, preliminary insurance verification, or checking or pre off. I walked up to my front desk and told my office manager, hey, Bill, their medical insurance for this. And you know what, I didn’t get paid. So that doesn’t work.

And you can’t get paid for this? Well, no, if you do it wrong, you won’t get paid for it. Yeah, right. Oh, there’s, you know, there’s a step. And so I hear that there’s a lot of, you know, there’s a lot of discussion there, you know, where people are fearful of that, and it is medical insurance, and it is scary. And, you know, if I say the word Medicare was like, Oh, I don’t want to take Medicare. But hey, Medicare is a huge, it’s the biggest insurance company on the planet. And they paid for this. You know, and sometimes they pay really well for this.

And Medicare patients, they accept or expect that you’ll take Medicare, and they accept treatment 100% of the time. So there’s a lot of benefits to doing it, too. But again, it doesn’t have to be a scary thing. It’s separate this Think of it as a separate business to it’s not, we’re not going to impact your dental practice at all. This has nothing to do with your dental business. Many dentists doing this create a separate business entity altogether, just for sleep. And yeah, you’re going to ideally, you would be a Medicare durable medical equipment supplier, it’s not a hard thing to do. It’s relatively easy. And again, you know, there’s there’s some steps to to get things in place to be able to build medical insurance and be reimbursed. Most people end up utilizing and what we do as SGS, we kind of have a concierge billing service type system where we’ll take care of that for an impression. And help them on a per case basis with all the Billings so that it doesn’t become a roadblock because that’s the other thing that comes up, right? You get the you get the doctor that goes back to your team.

After after this, this great workshop and everyone’s excited, and we’re gonna kill it and we’re gonna do sleep, it’s gonna be great. And now you go back and say, Okay, we got to do medical, and everyone’s like, no, whoa, stop. We’re not doing medical, it’s not gonna happen. No, no, no, no, no, no quick, let’s just tell them something shiny over here. And we’ll just forget about sleep all sudden. And we’ll just go back to dental business as usual. You don’t want your team to sabotage you either. And so if you tell them, Hey, we’re gonna do medical, but this other company is going to really take care of all of the for us. And our job is just to do a really good clinical job. And we’re going to take good records and good notes.

And that’s it. And we’ll supply that information as requested. But really, it’s just to be a health care provider and not worry about the admin side. Now down the road, when you get super busy, maybe having an in house medical biller makes sense. But early on, you know, doing 10 or 12-15 a month, you don’t really need to deal with that in house.

REGAN: One thing that I thought was really interesting, john, when we were speaking was at Chad I think you’ll appreciate this since you were the King of Delegation. I was kind of under the assumption that you know, the doctor would come to this two day dental, Sleep Medicine certification and go on back to practice and then and then deal with it from there. I really didn’t realize at that time, how many elements are are key to that. So how are in addition to medical billing, what are some of the other ways that doctors can delegate that power? Like you said, you know, so that that the teams all rowing in the same direction and aligned on this new mission?

JOHN: Well, it’s, you know, look, everybody in the practice is going to have their own dedicated role to this, obviously. And hygiene primarily, is going to be a frontline, you know, frontline screener, they’re gonna identify high risk and have a conversation with the patient about airway, how it’s potentially impacting some of the dental complications they’ve seen, and suggest a deeper investigation, get the patient open, to at least looking a little bit more into this raise concern, the concern, not sell appliances, or even talk about appliances, or even say the word sleep apnea. I don’t want to do any of that stuff.

I just, we we carefully craft our conversations so that you can avoid objection from the patient. If we say, Oh, I think you have sleep apnea. They’re gonna say No, I don’t. My Uncle Bob has sleep apnea, he wears one of those mask things. And I don’t have that. Yeah, you do. But now I have to argue with you about it. And that’s not right, you know. So instead, I’m going to use different words, I’m going to talk about sleep, health and wellness. And I’m going to say sleep disordered breathing, which means the same thing, but you’re not going to argue with me about it when I bring it up. So yeah, your hygiene team is going to focus a lot on screening and a lot of frontline stuff in obviously, the administrative staff, there’s a lot of documentation, we need to get an order in order to be paid for this successfully.

Because, you know, medical insurance is critical. And if we do everything right from the start, that’s going to help getting reimbursed later. So that’s huge. Obviously, your assistance, you know, one of the things that, you know, in all these big practices that do a lot of sleep. One of the things we looked back a few years ago, actually and across the board, like every single one, I started talking to my customer care team and say, Okay, what about this guy? What about this girl about this office over here and what she doing? universally, one of the things that came up was that they weren’t in touch with the doctor at all. They were in touch with the sleep coordinator, they were in touch with somebody that was kind of elevated or promoted or kind of empowered into a new position and most of them were assistants but they weren’t called asleep care coordinator.

And they were really quarterbacking much of the process. And I was like, geez, this, these offices are crushing it, they’re doing 30, 40, 50, 60 cases a month. And my team’s not even in touch with the doctor because they’re talking to the sick coordinator every couple days. And I was like, that’s interesting. And you look at it and that’s, that’s really how it is, though a lot of these practices, you can you can delegate and much of the clinical process, all of the clinical process can be handled by that train that slip coordinator, the doctor time and asleep case if done right. Should be consultative, it should be a conversation. You need to be a doctor you need to, to come in as the authority as the you know, just like a physician does.

You’re going to talk to them about their results. You’re going to talk to them about their their diagnosis and what the sleep physician has prescribed for them, right because you’re not selling an appliance. You’re telling them what the sleep physician says they need me to talk to them about all the you know, the issues there. But it’s, it’s a conversation, you’re being paid to, to have that consultation, not, you know, hunched over busting your neck and back, you know, trying to produce for dentistry, it’s talking to people and being that authority being a doctor and, and they go to the next one. You go be a doctor there too. And your assistant does most of the steps, most of the clinical, all the airway measurements, all the stuff we do for bites and titrations. And all that stuff is delegated. So it’s certainly a way to have a lot of production out of your team.

CHAD: So can you hear me okay, yeah, I just wanted to make sure my sound was good. Sorry. So tell me what, what do you do in your training that helps people integrate this more successfully, I imagine that there’s going to be talk about, you know, Medicare, billing and stuff like that I’m sure that you talk about, for example, you know, the verbiage and whatnot, but what are what are some of the key tenants to you’re helping a doctor become successful in the class without going into the whole course itself? Obviously,

JOHN: The high level of the course, I guess I could say, you know, we’re going to talk a lot about systems. And we’re going to talk about having the right conversations with people and engaging with patients the correct way. And really following a cookbook, it’s, it’s, it’s not rocket science. Try not to go, you know, verbally explode all over people, there’s steps to it, there’s the degrees of ownership, you know, unlike anything else, if people are properly educated, and they have their informed about their disease, because that’s, that’s a problem in sleep. Even in even in the medical side, the enemy patients I’ve talked to that have been through asleep, that diagnostic sleep test, right?

They have, they’re diagnosed with moderate to severe sleep apnea, they have a literally a life threatening condition, something that that could contribute to a heart attack or stroke, imminently. You know, they’re prescribed a C pap machine, which they don’t really know much about, other than they don’t like it. They sometimes never had FaceTime with a physician. And even after all of this, you sit down with them and say, hey, what sleep apnea and they can’t tell you. They can’t even answer the question. They don’t even know what it is. And it’s like, oh, my God, how can somebody? How can they be there?

How can they, they have this life threatening condition? You know, they’re prescribed lifetime therapy to address it. And they don’t even know what the disease is, if somebody gets diagnosed with cancer, what do they do? They become an expert on that cancer, they could tell you more about it than most of the physicians can tell you, you know, and that just doesn’t happen with sleep. And it’s amazing to me. So I think educating people is key, you know, because an educated patient now makes a better, more informed decision. And what what happens is insurance, which even though I just said is, you know, something we can tackle and manage insurance is not there. Why? Right? It’s not sure why you need treatment, who’s paying doesn’t matter. If you sit down with an oncologist. And the oncologist says, CHAD:, I’ve got some really bad news. You know, you’re not going to fire back, you’d

CHAD: Say, well, geez, does my insurance pay for that? Right? You don’t care? Right? It’s, that’s not that’s like, number 5000 on the list of things you care about at that time, right? The rationality of people and their disease, it’s, it’s something else, you know, what, I kind of think of it this way to periodontal disease is kind of that way within dentistry, where you don’t carry as people will say, with the truth doesn’t hurt. And when we talk about a pay mediated model, but there’s some there’s something I don’t know if it’s marketed or it’s just, you know, our culture that these days with cancer, you know, that word pops up and people go, alright, this is life or death, up, bucking up, and, you know, I’m all in boot camp and all around, you know, but but if you also say to someone a pervasive disease that’s insidious, like diabetes, and if you say, hey, you have diabetes, and people go, so I, I almost have a problem. And it’s like, No, you you have a problem.

And if Sleep Medicine would would like into that diabetic discussion where some people are going to be like, Okay, I’m going to do something about it, and other people are going to be like, so I just need to eat less. And it’s like, No, no, no, like, you’re you’re in a disease model, but it doesn’t hurt what I know but so I totally get that john is it’s a it’s a it’s a tough road for some and then For others, it clicks, you know, even if it’s a I had a discussion a couple weeks ago with a patient. And I said, you know, this is something that, that we could treat with the C Pap, no, I definitely want this the oral appliance, like, let’s just do it. And I didn’t even have to talk much about it. She had already looked it up. So you’ve got that whole, you know, scan that whole spectrum. spectrum? Yes.

So you kind of alluded to it before. But if you could give doctors one piece of advice, I’m going to put words in your mouth, the one, the one word of advice would be in September goes to the workshop for Productive Dentist Academy in the Dallas Fort Worth area. But if there was a second discussion piece, a second piece of advice that you were to give people in regards to sleep, incorporation into their dental practice, what would that be?

JOHN: You got to have a short answer. Yeah, number one, go to the workshop. Number two, you can do this, you know, don’t don’t let fear about insurance, or about complication, or say, oh, gosh, I’m gonna be pulling them forward, I’m gonna change their occlusion, their teeth might move, they might die if you don’t do it. So, you know, there’s, there’s all this such this side effects, I get that but don’t let fear of complication or side effect, get in your way of it. There is a system to follow, you don’t have to worry about physicians, you don’t have to worry about referrals, you know, you don’t have to worry about medical billing do right by your patients. You saw people today with their physician, their primary care doctor doesn’t see them and doesn’t refer for sleep until it’s usually at a catastrophic level.

You know, and that’s the that’s the reality. You know? If so, if not you then who, you know, you don’t get to choose, if you see people with sleep apnea or not, you know, right. That would be like saying, I don’t want to see anybody with Perrier, Well, too bad, you’re gonna, you know, it’s just, that’s, that’s life. And you’re gonna see people with sleep apnea too. So do right by them. You know, if nothing else, educate yourself enough to be a good quarterback, and a good shepherd of information so that you can direct them to the care they need, whether it’s you that’s going to provide it, or somebody else. You know, the bottom line here is that this is so unbelievably widespread. And you’ll change people’s lives. And that’s, that’s ultimately what we’re in this for.

CHAD: Wow, very cool.

REGAN:  Yeah. John thank you for your time. Thank you for sharing your message. Where can people go in addition to the PDA Workshop to learn about Dental Sleep Solutions.

JOHN:   Yeah, if, you know, I, obviously, I’m excited for the PDA Workshop. And I’ll be there the whole time and teaching and it’s going to be a great program. We have courses all over the country, should stuff come up or just you know, online, if you can’t make the PDA workshop, I’ve got a great team of people all over the place to help with education and training in this. So just sleep grip solutions calm, and, and, you know, reach out that way. And we’ll be in touch and can help you. But I’m looking forward to to the workshop in September. I think that’s gonna be a fantastic program. I think that you know, what I’m excited about too, is the team of people that doctors that you guys have traditionally worked with through these programs. You know, they, they have the right mindset for this. And that’s what I’m excited about. So I think it’s gonna be a really good fit.

REGAN: Chad and I will be there and we cannot wait to see you in my whole team. Oh, yeah. Well, thank you so much for being our episode. We’ll see you in September.