Episode 53 – Building a Culture of Trust with Kashmere Fitch, MA

“This is your office and your culture; you have your whole team – and not just one team member – to be responsible for.”
– Kashmere Fitch, MA

The workforce today faces a growing trend of “quiet quitting,” where highly skilled and talented employees become completely demoralized and and do only the minimum amount of work required to get their job done. This has a detrimental and cascading effect on the employee, productivity, and the overall culture of the company.

So, what happens when leadership takes culture seriously? The best leaders build cultures of trust, where team members can interact with and react to each other without fear of reprisals. They understand it’s not whether or not you’ve made a mistake, but how you recover from it.

At a time when staffing dental practices with highly skilled team members is becoming increasingly difficult, it’s essential to consider the impact that tolerating poor performance from other employees can have on high achievers. This is why creating a culture of trust is so important. It fosters a sense of belonging and a belief that they truly are part of something bigger. 

Join me and PDA Event & Podcast Producer Kashmere Fitch, MA, as we discuss the importance of culture, and what doctors can do in their own practices to create a culture that nobody would ever want to leave.

3 Key Points/Takeaways: 

• What happens to your culture when you don’t address bad behavior
• What monitoring behavior can do to improve it
• When it’s OK to let an employee go

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EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

Regan 0:00
Hi, Dr. Regan, Robertson, CCO Productive Dentist Academy here and have a question for you. Are you finding it hard to get your team aligned to your vision, but you know, you deserve growth just like everybody else. That’s why we’ve created the PDA productivity workshop. For nearly 20 years PDA workshops have helped dentists just like you align their teams, get control of scheduling, and create productive practices that they love walking into every day. Just imagine how you will feel when you know your schedule is productive, your systems are humming, and your team is aligned to your vision. It’s simple, but it’s not necessarily easy. We can help visit productivedentist.com/workshop that’s productivedentist.com/workshop to secure your seats.

Kashmere Fitch 0:45
Now that is part of being a leader is you have to model that you have to model the behavior you want to see. So I mean, it’s as silly as if, if you want people to show up on time, if you want everybody there at eight o’clock, you better not come waltzing in it, you know, 8:10 very morning, Pete That’s that’s not going to fly for very long. It’s that’s really an integrity piece, which I think ties in with that like trust. But those are those culture pieces that you create. So if you want to create a safe and open environment, where it is safe and open for people to share, when something kind of goes wrong, you do have to model that

Narrator 1:24
Welcome to Investment Grade Practices podcast where we believe private practice dentists deserve to get the lifestyle today while building an asset for tomorrow. Join your host Victoria Peterson to design the practice of your dreams and secure your financial independence. Let’s get started.

Victoria Peterson 1:46
Welcome to this very special edition of Investment Grade Practice, and on the last episode, we talked with our with Regan Robertson, who has held many roles within the Productive Dentist Academy. And I thought I would continue that theme with Kashmere Fitch. Now many of you know Kashmere’s work, even if you don’t know her name, because she is our Podcast Producer, but you’re so much more than that Kashmere and I want, we had a great conversation last night with our private member’s group, and you were accidentally the star of the show, and I was just such a great conversation about culture, and you bring an incredible viewpoint from an employee standpoint that a lot of times owners don’t get a window into what employees think about with their, their team, right, and so welcome Kashmere Fitch to this episode of Investment Grade Practices.

Kashmere Fitch 2:48
Well, thank you very much for coaxing me in front of the microphone instead of letting me hide behind it.

Victoria Peterson 2:54
Tell everyone what your official role is, because I know you’ve held several, I don’t how many jobs have you had with us over the years,

Kashmere Fitch 3:00
Maybe three, four, or five, something like that I’m a PDA’s Event and Podcast Producer. So if you see a webinar, or if you hear a podcast, if you attend one of our events, I’m involved in all of them.

Victoria Peterson 3:15
And involved meaning it wouldn’t happen without her.

Kashmere Fitch 3:19
Oh, something like that.

Victoria Peterson 3:23
So to give all of our listeners a background, you know, when you think about dental consultants in our industry, you’re typically thinking about a singular person who has a small company, maybe they have, you know, some support personnel, but Productive Dentist Academy is different. We have up to 40 employees at any given time, depending on the season and how we flex because we have a full ad agency that builds smoking hot websites. I think we have the fastest load speed and the most accessible websites in the marketplace, but we do that pay-per-click radio, TV, streaming on Hulu, just all kinds of stuff for our clients, we found in 2011, that it was time for us to stop doing marketing strategies and actually implement the strategy. So we have a huge marketing team. We also have the client-facing team or of our coaches that go out in the field, and we have our educational team that helps us build online content. So it’s a very complex organization and we have gone through some changes just like everyone else and I think that was refreshing for our clients last night to hear like, “Oh PDA is a company just like us as a company. Victoria is a leader just like we’re a leader and she makes mistakes and our company makes mistakes.” But it’s it’s not that will you make a mistake or not. It’s how you recover from it. And so I’m giving cashmere, total permission to say whatever, like just speak truth here today about the ups and downs of PDA and I want to kind of get into culture, have a bit, you know, because it’s culture is just it’s hard to define, it’s hard to wrap your hands around. So, from your perspective Kashmere, what is culture? How, you know, how do you know the culture within an organization?

Kashmere Fitch 5:19
Well, I think the culture is very much something. It is the people I know that might sound a little bit on the simple side, but it is the people, how they show up, and how they interact with each other, and how they react to each other. So for example, if you have a culture of a, what’s the one that we like to talk about a lot, a culture of trust? Well, there’s behaviors that are aligned with that issue of trust. So what are those people when they show up, when the people show up in trust? Well, what does that mean? What behaviors are they showing, are they exhibiting, if there is a problem that happens? So like a great example, we’ll use examples will tell stories. If you’ve seen any of our marketing, any of our marketing emails, I probably touched it, I probably was in charge of making sure it was written, it had all the pieces in it and then got sent. Well, for those of you who work with software, you know that software does not always work if you want to and, for example, we had something glitch within our software and I didn’t really know what happened. So I went to Regan Robertson, who is our Chief Communications Officer, my boss, and was like, “Hey, look, this glitch, this happened this, this did not go right.” And she kind of laughed and said, “Yeah, I saw that something went wrong, but I trusted that you would fix it, and you were going to fix it.” And that’s a really, really tangible example of culture, something went wrong, and Reagan, one of our leaders reacted to that with calmness and trust that I would figure out what happened and it takes a potentially stressful situation, it makes it really, really calm. So I think that’s a really an, a really good safe place to be as an employee, because you know, within that culture of trust, that you’re not going to be blamed for something that goes wrong. You have permission to go figure out what happened, and then to fix it and bring it to your leaders.

Victoria Peterson 7:27
Oh, man, I love that. Have you ever worked in a place that wasn’t like that?

Kashmere Fitch 7:30
I did. In my previous job before PDA I was in a company like that and we’ll use the email software again as an example and oh, yes, that software glitch, too, and when my boss figured out what had gone on, she got very angry and she got upset because she didn’t know what was going on, and it said, made me upset, and made me very defensive, and actually, if we’re going to be really super honest here, that was something that I had to work on. When I got to PDA, was not reacting in anger when things happened that went wrong, because at my former job, it was not a safe environment, it was not a place of trust. So when something went wrong, if I learned as I got angry, people would back off, so that I could fix the problem, and then bring them the solution, but at PDA, because there’s that environment of trust, I know I can, if something goes wrong, I can go to our leadership and say, “Hey, this went wrong, here’s how I’m fixing it, ” and I can ask for help if I need it. Yeah, that’s

Victoria Peterson 8:49
Yeah that’s, your mind so many golden nuggets. So that’s one that was a big topic we got into last night is what is the owner’s role, what is the leader or the manager’s role, you just pointed out that you worked in an environment where trusting people to fix their mistakes was not present, and so you hide your mistakes, because you don’t want to get yelled at who wants to get yelled at, and then you’ve got to come and learn what the new culture is and then you’ve got to adapt and change your own triggers, right? So we all have these emotional triggers and this emotional. I used to call it baggage, now maybe it’s just gifts, we haven’t, we bring with us everywhere we go, and, you know, for me as a leader for a long time, I just wanted to fix it for everybody. You know, and I would because, you know, through my degrees and spirituality and life coaching and emotional intelligence and positive Intelligence, I think I’ve studied every intelligence there is right. So I would have one on one coaching sessions and I’m going to mentor people up, and while all of that is really good, what I was doing I was denying accountability, like I was taking on the accountability for the mistake instead of saying, “Thank you so much for sharing now, what will you do about that, right?” So in some ways, I feel like in the past, I was creating codependent relationships,

Kashmere Fitch 10:16
Right!

Victoria Peterson 10:18
So you gave us such a big nugget there. So building like, decide what the value is, what is the core value? So in your example, building a culture of trust, then what are the behaviors that show up with trust? And you gave us some examples that it’s a safe open environment to take failure bow and say that it goes well, and then your manager trust that they can work with you on solution, right. And that’s going to happen.

Kashmere Fitch 10:49
And I’m really glad you mentioned that, that bringing up that that failure bow, we talked about that a little bit last night, and I love I love that concept. For anybody who doesn’t know what a failure bail is, it’s essentially saying, “Hey, everybody, something went wrong, that was that was on me, letting you all know what happened, I’m fixing it.” And you take a little a ticket, a flourish of a bow and everybody takes the claps for you, you all smile, you laugh, you fix the problem, and you move on. It’s a very safe way to say because nobody’s perfect. I mean, even with our best intentions, things do go wrong, but it’s a really good way to allow people to take ownership of when something goes wrong. “Hey, everybody, something went wrong. Should have been me, that’s on me, I’m fixing it what happened again,” um, and you, Victoria and Regan model that and that’s a really, really key piece.

Victoria Peterson 11:44
I take failure bows on the daily.

Kashmere Fitch 11:47
And that’s that is just that as part of being a leader is you have to model that you have to model the behavior you want to see. So I mean, it’s as silly as if, if you want people to show up on time, if you want everybody there at eight o’clock, you better not come waltzing in it, you know, 8:10 every morning. Pete, that’s that’s not going to fly for very long. It’s that’s really an integrity piece, which I think ties in with that like trust, but those are all those culture pieces that you create. So if you want to create a safe and open environment, where it is safe and open for people to share, when something kind of goes wrong, you have to model that.

Victoria Peterson 12:27
Love it. I want to talk about, because this is where like, I see doctors, especially right now in healthcare as a sector, any business that is brick and mortar that requires people to show up on the daily, is not very popular with Americans right now. Like, we have no problem we put out, oh, gosh, we put out, accidentally, a classified ad to indeed for a graphic designer. I needed to open it up to get one resume in and I forgot to pause it. So it is Friday afternoon until Sunday afternoon, and then I saw a text from Reagan saying turn it off. We had 391 applications in 48 hours on an accident post right? So virtual is very popular. We don’t have a problem attracting high-quality talent, but there is a huge difficulty attracting talent in dentistry right now. So the turnovers especially clinically for assistants and hygienists, finding qualified administrators who really understand billing and medical billing. I mean, these are highly specific, high skilled jobs, and it seems like the employers are walking on pins and needles like just don’t piss off the employees. I don’t care how bad she is. They’re breathing and you know,

Kashmere Fitch 13:52
They can have their breathing up right in here, that’s all I want.

Victoria Peterson 13:55
That’s all I want, but there is a, I see if I can find this article and bring it back out. It’s called the high cost of low morale, and I wrote that, I’m gonna say in 1996 and things have not changed. So talk to me about what happens to high achievers and peak performers on your team when owners tolerate poor performance with others on the team. Tell me about that from your, your perspective.

Kashmere Fitch 14:41
Well, when your gosh I feel silly saying this but when you are a peak performer, when you are somebody who is a hard worker and wants to do a good job and wants to be focused and that A type personality that is like let’s get the job done and let’s do it right and let’s make sure everything is taken care of. When you see team members and teammates, who are either allowed to slack off, or get away with pretty like bad or damaging behavior, it can be very demoralizing as an employee, as a as somebody who’s working at a company, because you wonder, wait a minute, I’m putting in all this time and effort and work into this and all this care and dedication and my teammate who’s putting in no effort, complaining about everything showing up late and really refusing to do what they really should be doing. They’re getting paid the same as I am. So why should I bother to continue working this hard when I could be slacking off and getting paid just as much? And then you start wondering, you know, what, maybe my talents and efforts and work ethic would be better appreciated elsewhere. So I think that that is something that a lot of leaders and don’t necessarily understand the damage you can do to your really good employees if you tolerate bad behavior from other employees.

Victoria Peterson 16:34
What is that phrase that is so popular right now? Like the great slow down or the quiet, quiet quitting? In that?

Kashmere Fitch 16:42
Yeah,I think it’s quiet quitting, I think. Yeah, quitting.

Victoria Peterson 16:44
So you just described quiet quitting, like I’m showing up and here’s the fun part, you’re really bad employees, smile to the boss. “Oh, my God, I love working here. This is the greatest place ever.” You’re wonderful to the boss, I think gets in this place of and then the team is gone. “Oh, my OMG,” and rolling their eyes and like, you’ve got to be kidding me, because drama queens really know how to play the game, and I say drama queens, because dentistry is so high. So highly skewed from male, right, but they particularly if you’re a male boss, you know, little girls start playing how to bring on alligator tears were their daddies when they’re two years old. So the crying the tears, all of that. I’m not saying that the emotions aren’t real, but it is a tactic to trick your boss is a tactic to get out of accountability sometimes, and other employees notice that that’s what I’m hearing you say Kashmere.

Kashmere Fitch 17:28
Yeah. Yeah, they do. And like you said, it can be really, it can be kind of stressful thinking like, oh, my gosh, I don’t want to, you know, confront this bad behavior, or I don’t want to deal with this, you know, I mean, I, for anybody who doesn’t know, I coached high school robotics team for three years, I was a head coach, and we had a lot of teenage emotions rolling around, as you can imagine.

Victoria Peterson 18:10
Well, wait, wait, before you go, on, tell them where your teams placed.

Kashmere Fitch 18:15
We were world champions.

Victoria Peterson 18:17
Yeah, so she’s a world champion robotics coach, I just see, that’s the other thing about peak performers, they don’t brag on themselves. So I’m gonna brag for you.

Kashmere Fitch 18:27
Thank you, but the students did a lot of work to and there were a lot of other adult mentors. It was definitely a team effort, but you have, like we had, you know, we did have some, there were some bad behaviors, and I had to address those immediately. Of no, you may not speak unkindly to so and so I don’t care how stressed stressed out you are, that behavior is not acceptable. I don’t care if you’re a team leader. In fact, I care more, because you’re one of our student leaders, and you need to be modeling the way, so here’s this behavior is inappropriate. Tell me what’s going on. Tell me why we’re having this conversation and tell me how we can fix it, because if you allow that behavior to go on, and there was one situation I allowed to go on a little too long, and it caused damage and we lost people because of that, because people are not going to tolerate that kind of kind of behavior, they will leave.

Victoria Peterson 19:26
Yeah, well, I was going to ask you the question, but you’re already given the answer, of you know, how, what would you tell bosses, you know, when they’re in the situation and your first clue was raise the bar when you see bad behavior and say, “I expect more from you because you have leadership potential, because you’re a key member of this team? I expect more. So yes, would you tell, what else would you tell bosses? Give us the 123, on Gosh, boy, how to, how to like, you’ve helped us like define the culture in a general way, right? So there’s key characteristics of how you expect people to show up. Now, how do we, how do we address that when people aren’t matching our values?

Kashmere Fitch 20:17
I think the first thing to do is if you really do see a disconnect between the behavior that you’re seeing and the behavior you want, the first thing is to ask them, to sit down with that person, and ask them why you think that you might be having a conversation, because people are a lot more intelligent and we’re working with adults, let’s remember that too. We’re working with adults, people usually recognize when their behavior is off and usually, I didn’t used to be this way, I used to be a little bit more like, oh, my gosh, get yourself sir. I mean, there, there are still a part of me that wants to say, you know, you know, slap them upside the head, get your act together, knock it off, but there usually is, is something else going on. If you’re seeing a behavior you don’t want or like, there’s usually something a reason why the person is acting that way. So let’s say you’ve got an employee who’s, who’s angry and spouting off and well, there actually might be something really stressful to them that they don’t know to bring to you until you actually sit down and go, “Hey, something seems off. Tell it talk to me about what’s up.” Yeah, and then, once you do that, you do have to, you know, define the, “Okay, look, you know, this is why we’re having this conversation.” And then as you move forward, that kind of step number two, I would say is you keep an eye on that, because I do believe in grace, I do believe in second chances. I do believe people need an opportunity to step up, but then there are some people who don’t want to or who are unable to step up and then I would say, then you’re looking at it, “Hey, you know, look, so and so this is the second time we’ve had to have this conversation, what would you suggest we do to modify these behaviors? Because this really is, is not acceptable, how things are going.” And then the really, the third thing is, sometimes you do have to let people, what is Bruce say? What do you guys say? Do let people find their happy place, right, encourage people to find their happy place, which does mean and maybe less chi terms, it’s time to let them go, because you’ve given them the opportunity, you’ve supported them, you’ve walked with them on their journey through this, and for whatever reason, they are either unable or unwilling to, to model the behaviors that you need. So at that point, it is time to let them go, because you have to mind your culture. So doctors, dentists, this is your office and your culture, and you have you all of your patients and your team, your whole team, not just one team member to to be responsible for.

Victoria Peterson 23:16
Such a mic drop, center my job. I’m going to reflect this back, because it’s just so good, and you know, yes, we do believe everybody should find your happy place. So honestly, if ever I’m unhappy with an employee, like chronically not in the moment, but you just see, there’s usually a disconnect, like you were talking about and the employees aren’t happy either, and you can feel it even in a virtual company, you could feel it 3000 miles apart over zoom, you can feel it, because we’re energetic beings, right? And so what you were speaking to is sometimes people don’t have the capabilities, right? And or they don’t have the capacity. They’re running so hard, the team is short staffed, and people just run out of hours and days and brainpower and so we’re always looking at capacity. You know, we’ve hit the Inc 500O four times not because we’re sitting around doing nothing, we are always stretched like a rubber band in growth mode. We love growth mode is a chaotic mode, and we have to be very careful about capacity and like I periodically call people and say you are on mandatory PTO, get the heck out of here.

Kashmere Fitch 24:32
I don’t want to talk to you for a week you go blind, right.

Victoria Peterson 24:35
So it takes it takes a lot of strength as a leader to be in the conversation with people and say, “Is this the right place for you today?” And so getting back to this year of it’s so difficult to find people we don’t we don’t address bad behavior and then it gets worse, it’s a cycle that is a downward spiral, you know, that builds on itself. Yeah, one of the things we talked about last night was how to get out of that spiral. So I’ll give you my top three things and cashmere, you can you can just say does she really do this or not? Perpetually look for talent, always look for talent, don’t stop advertising, don’t stop looking, have the growth mindset within your practice, have your role descriptors, the pay bands, the interview questions, like set that up. I was gonna say, in a quiet time when it’s calm, but that may not ever come, but set aside a time to get every role like in our HR system, I have almost every role now loaded in that system. So as we grow, or people go back to school, or they retire, they have babies, all of that stuff comes up, all I have to do is click launch, and now we’re back in the market, and it goes out to ND for free. So you’ve got to have a system for recruitment and onboarding. So that takes away the fear of oh my god, what will I do without this person I lived in that fear for so long, and when you have small teams, you know, like a typical dental office, five team members, 10 team members, everybody’s so crucial, change is so hard. So number one, be organized in your HR system, and be prepared to always, you know, look for talent.

Kashmere Fitch 26:29
And you know, within that, I think it’s also really important to to make sure that people are set up, your organization is set up so people can take a break. So if you got, you know, five columns holding up the house, if you take away one of the columns, the whole thing doesn’t collapse, right? That the other ones can take the load for the week, two weeks, three weeks or month, if somebody’s you know, gone either ill, on PTO or has a you know, random accident that happens, it’s very important to make sure that you are set up. So the whole thing doesn’t collapse, if somebody has to leave.

Victoria Peterson 27:07
That comes to the rules rule of three, and we’re starting to get there in our company where at least three people are trained on every system. So three people should know event planning and right now that whole thing is on your shoulders. We can take parts and pieces of it, but in the interviews like for team development coaches and marketing consultants and things like that, I’m finding people who have event planning experience. Tyson who just joined our team has a great experience. So now you can start sharing the load. It doesn’t mean we’re coming for your job, is that we’re going to grow and we’re going to build teams of competencies. So I think that’s a great thing for employers to look for, what are the competencies of the role, not just the title of the roles, because every role title has so many different ways it could be implemented. Oh, Kashmere, this has been a great topic.

Victoria Peterson 28:09
Thank you for, for helping us see from an employee standpoint, you know, what happens when you tolerate bad behavior? What end with you sharing, because, you know, PDA has gone through some transitions, you know, the pandemic was difficult on all of us. We were a half in-person team with 28 people working in a 4000-square-foot building. And within a week, the building cleared out, and no one ever came back, and we went down to 1000 square feet, where we put together all the beautiful boxes that we you know, send gifts and things. Yep. So that was a huge change in our organization. It rocked us to our core culture didn’t hold steady during those times. We didn’t have as much safety as you’re describing today. So from an employee’s perspective, what happens when leadership takes culture seriously, and brings it down and threads those behaviors and threads, the value through the behaviors, through the role descriptors, through everything that we do? What does that look like when the leaders have the courage to do that?

Kashmere Fitch 29:21
I think it creates that, that touchstone that you can go back to when things do get, what do we like to say? When they get crunchy, when they get uncomfortable when they get uncertain is if you model those behaviors that at making it a safe place where you’re you’re open and you keep the lines of communication open. You Victoria and Reagan, our leadership is very, very open and honest about what you’re doing, and you know where things are and how they might affect us. So like, you know, you’re right. Things are a little chaotic right now or you’re right, they are changing, and you ask us, you, you do treat us like adults. We are we’re working, we’re getting we’re working with adults of what would you like to see. So when you go through those, and you guys have taken culture, so very seriously, it fosters an environment of trust. So we know as employees, you’re taking it very seriously, you approach it very calmly as well. You come into those meetings and into those points of sharing very, very calmly. So we know you model, when you model the way, then we go, “Oh, oh, we don’t have to panic right now, they’re, they’re not panicking. So we don’t need to.” And because you’ve taken so much care of the culture, it’s taken time. I mean, I think you would agree it’s it’s taken time and a lot of effort on your guy’s part, but if you are truly this is Investment Grade Practices, and if you truly are interested in developing a durable business that will last in the long term, it’s it’s worth it, because I think you guys you have, you’ve seen you put so much effort into the culture that as the company grows, and changes and positions change, and things become a little, you know, murky, and before they clear up, you have a culture where your employees trust you and contribute, because they feel that they’re actually they are part of something bigger.

Victoria Peterson 31:41
Oh, that’s wonderful. Yeah, end for those who don’t know, our company is an ESOP. That means we’re in we have employee stock options, and Kashmere is my partner. She doesn’t work for me, I think I work for you. I’m always, I’m always behind, particularly with my podcast, but it is something that I appreciate you helping us make this more tangible. You know, someone asked last night, “What is the difference between a cult and culture?” And for me, a cult is when you have a singular mindset, mandate that people are indoctrinated into that mindset. So usually led by very charismatic leaders that have something to give to the people that are following them, right. So there’s usually a wound or something of that nature that people feel vulnerable, and this person has come to save them in some way. And then there’s a singular mindset, and it gets really weird, really fast. Culture, on the other hand, is where you can foster an environment that is healthy, where everyone can contribute their opinions, and you that’s one definition of culture, but it has multiple viewpoints, and it has traditions that are shared it has. We’ve got a lot of fun, quirky traditions, you know, we still we start our meetings with some banging music, and, you know, we’ve got so many we do, we give everybody the clap, right? The club A clap. We have spirit animals of the year, you know, our culture is just, it’s fun, it’s dynamic, it’s engaging, and all of that has always been true. What has made the difference, I think, is putting the structure and committing to the structure of culture and that’s, that’s what we talk about a lot through coaching is, how do you put on how do you? How do you connect your core values to your HR system? How do you do employee surveys that allow the employees to tell you the real real and not have any repercussions for it? Like all of those things, for me, if you’re listening all the way to the end, I’m going to tell I have repeated it 15,000 times this year, it is the new frontier of competitive advantage. Your employer Net Promoter Score, what your indeed profile looks like your Glassdoor profile, and if you look ours up, we look pretty pitiful right now, we have nothing out there. We need to work on this ourselves. So I think that’s why it’s top of mind. Kashmere, you’re the best I’m gonna bring you back as a guest again, because you are given us so many pearls of wisdom and great insight from employees’ perspective on leadership.

Kashmere Fitch 34:28
Well, thank you for having me on here. It’s it’s fun to talk about the, the inside of a PDA because, you know, we practice what we preach, and I’m happy to share that and it’s been a journey, but it’s also thank you, thank you for for all the effort and the time. I mean, that’s just part of your job. You’ve got what, eight, eight or nine different hats you wear, well, maybe 90 different hats you wear, and so thank you from an employee perspective. Thank you for the time and effort you’ve put into that into creating a company that is a really good place to be and does really good work and takes care of the employees. So thank you.

Victoria Peterson 34:53
Well, Mahalo.

Kashmere Fitch 34:54
Mahalo.

Narrator 35:16
Thank you for tuning in to this episode of Investment Grade Practices podcast. If you find value in this episode, help us spread the word by passing it along to a dental friend, subscribe and give us a Like on iTunes or Spotify. Learn more about building your Investment Grade Practice at productivedentist.com Today